Comments on: First Pitch: Why the Pirates Shouldn’t (Have) Sign(ed) Russell Martin

By: jalcorn

jalcorn — Fri, 30 Nov 2012 20:58:48 +0000

Karstens is gone. JMac is a huge ?. You have two rookies (Locke, McPherson) a reliever (Wilson) and a guy who will be good but not any sooner than June (Cole). That leaves two known quantities at SP. They desperately need SP.

BTW, EJax certainly does not suck. He is a 3 WAR SP on par with AJ.

By: Y2JGQ2

Y2JGQ2 — Fri, 30 Nov 2012 20:28:24 +0000

jackson sucks…..why would we want him? We can’t have a control challenged pitcher on this team with the way we handle the running game. disasterous

By: Y2JGQ2

Y2JGQ2 — Fri, 30 Nov 2012 20:26:37 +0000

Jalcorn- I completely disagree in getting a starting pitcher. I think it’s superfluous and by all accounts, blocks what is our talent pool (minor league sp) from reaching their potential. Every year of wear and tear on the arm gives one less year of time in the big leagues, when pitchers are ready, blocking them with established small upside starters for 12X more per year, just makes no sense at all. The best bet is to keep Karstens because if he gets hurt it’s not a big deal, we will have kids ready, and karstens can handle the demotion and perform well out of the pen. McDonald Rodriguez Burnett, Karstens and (locke, mcpherson, wilson, cole) for the 5th spot is fine in fact i think it’s a perfect mix of youth and veteran presence. Cole will likely be ready by mid to late season, and it seems silly to put someone in his way who probably won’t be nearly as good as him down the line. Morton may even be brought back at a lower cost as well for the stretch run next year, so why the need for an sp?

By: TonyPenaforHOF

TonyPenaforHOF — Fri, 30 Nov 2012 17:46:07 +0000

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/russell-martin-bringing-new-element-to-pirates-baseball/

This is why I love Fangraphs…

By: jalcorn

jalcorn — Fri, 30 Nov 2012 16:55:11 +0000

They will be over $70 if the tender everyone, check Tim’s numbers on the payroll/roster link. At any rate it will be the highest payroll in team history.

By: WNCRoadBowling

WNCRoadBowling — Fri, 30 Nov 2012 16:51:41 +0000

Take into account the fact that the Pirates aren’t paying all of Burnett and Rodriguez’s salaries and even if they tender everyone the Pirates still won’t be paying much more the $60M.

By: jalcorn

jalcorn — Fri, 30 Nov 2012 16:32:25 +0000

One other thing, the money issue, with the new Root deal and improved attendance the Bucs can afford $70 million right now, with next year’s big TV money, we can spend 90 million. I don’t think this move precludes adding a Edwin Jackson or Brandon McCarthy. on a 3/$36 type deal. I have been beating the SP drum all offseason, it is still the #1 need. NH just filled the #2 need with an affordable upgrade.

By: beatembuccos21

beatembuccos21 — Fri, 30 Nov 2012 15:54:45 +0000

wkkortas is correct. Stating that every team in the playoffs had a mid to upper tier catcher is a gross exaggeration. In addition to the players named by wkkortas, the 2012 and 2011 playoffs also featured Derek Norris, Yorvit Torrealba and Kelly Shoppach.

By: wkkortas

wkkortas — Fri, 30 Nov 2012 15:39:52 +0000

You mean like Jesus Flores? Ryan Hanigan? Kurt Suzuki? There is zero correlation between quality catching and post-season play. As far as the Yankees spending $10 million on Rivera…well, the Yankees have that kind of money underneath the cushions on the couch. The Yankees can afford to mis-allocate resources, because they make money hand over fist. The Pirates’ finances are somewhat different.

By: jalcorn

jalcorn — Fri, 30 Nov 2012 15:38:57 +0000

Have to agree to disagree here Tim. This is a very big upgrade from a -0.2 WAR catcher to a 2.2 WAR guy for a price tag well below market value for 2.5 wins. Before you go on about Yankee stadium keep in mind that WAR is context, league, and park neutral. For another fair review of the signing check out –

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/russell-martin-bringing-new-element-to-pirates-baseball/