Comments on: First Pitch: The Downside of the New CBA Starting to Appear For the Pirates http://www.piratesprospects.com/2013/04/first-pitch-the-downside-of-the-new-cba-starting-to-appear-for-the-pirates.html Your best source for news on the Pittsburgh Pirates and their minor league system. Mon, 22 Sep 2014 18:17:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.9.2 By: bqjd http://www.piratesprospects.com/2013/04/first-pitch-the-downside-of-the-new-cba-starting-to-appear-for-the-pirates.html#comment-26239 Wed, 10 Apr 2013 18:59:28 +0000 http://www.piratesprospects.com/?p=49904#comment-26239 Curtis,
The yankees may have taken bell, but then whoever they drafted would have fallen. The fact that a team can only draft so many players, prevented big market teams from throwing a bunch of money at the draft and outspending smaller market teams

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By: bqjd http://www.piratesprospects.com/2013/04/first-pitch-the-downside-of-the-new-cba-starting-to-appear-for-the-pirates.html#comment-26238 Wed, 10 Apr 2013 18:55:13 +0000 http://www.piratesprospects.com/?p=49904#comment-26238 I’m not sure if this true or not, but I believe somewhere an NL team could prevent the road team from broadcasting the game. If true, this would be my plan of action.

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By: leadoff http://www.piratesprospects.com/2013/04/first-pitch-the-downside-of-the-new-cba-starting-to-appear-for-the-pirates.html#comment-26237 Wed, 10 Apr 2013 18:54:46 +0000 http://www.piratesprospects.com/?p=49904#comment-26237 IMO, I don’t think draft spending ought to be performance based in any way.
I think it should be based on Market size, how that would be broken down might get a little complicated, but IMO, it could be done. The Pirates could win the world series and never have the money to afford one Grienke, not that he is anyone I would spend 25 mil on, and with the current system they would not get enough money to draft me, well maybe they could!

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By: jg941 http://www.piratesprospects.com/2013/04/first-pitch-the-downside-of-the-new-cba-starting-to-appear-for-the-pirates.html#comment-26234 Wed, 10 Apr 2013 18:11:33 +0000 http://www.piratesprospects.com/?p=49904#comment-26234 Outside of the REAL permanent solution – a salary cap-and-floor system similar to the NFL – you could just keep attaching other market/payroll-based factors to smooth out the equation a little more.

Once you calculate the various domestic and international draft pools based on prior year performance, couldn’t you just introduce another variable based on EXISTING payroll and/or market size factor?

If it was a payroll-based thing – you could still give the second-highest draft pool to the Cubs because they were the second-worst team. But, if they also had a payroll of $104 mil, and that was (roughly) 3.4% of total MLB payrolls, you could give them a “haircut” off of their bonus pool of some factor of that 3.4%.

For instance, if you thought, say, 3 times that was fair, then the Cubs would get their performance-based draft pool, less 10.2% (3.4% X 3) as a ‘large-market/luxury adjustment’ to their pool. Maybe it needs to only be 2X their percentage of payrolls, maybe it needs to be 5X, don’t know, whatever everyone agrees on as the factor.

What you don’t want/need to happen under the current rules is to REWARD poorly managed teams who already spend boatloads of money on current contracts and free agency – and still lose – by throwing even MORE money at them in all of the other areas of talent accumulation.

I think an approach that continuously blends performance AND spending AND market size is a little more intuitive and might create a better metric than sticking to a non-salary-cap system that focuses on only one of those variables. IMO

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By: Fred Langford http://www.piratesprospects.com/2013/04/first-pitch-the-downside-of-the-new-cba-starting-to-appear-for-the-pirates.html#comment-26233 Wed, 10 Apr 2013 17:12:28 +0000 http://www.piratesprospects.com/?p=49904#comment-26233 Exactly, the system was designed for an upstart to win on any given year but not be able to sustain it…it appears even that will be fading…teams in the poor will continue to defy odds and scout and develop great and win for a year…but it is nearly impossible to sustain. …then again when you have the bucs getting rid of young pitchers and hitters to keep the Inges and McDonalds of the world…it makes the hopelessness even worse.

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By: Fred Langford http://www.piratesprospects.com/2013/04/first-pitch-the-downside-of-the-new-cba-starting-to-appear-for-the-pirates.html#comment-26232 Wed, 10 Apr 2013 17:07:40 +0000 http://www.piratesprospects.com/?p=49904#comment-26232 Definitely,…and the NFL has thrived by treating teams equally. I was thinking the same thing earlier…the poor teams should just threaten strike on the next cba. Bill James understands more than anyone as both a fan and a guy who studies the game. I read somewhere that sometime around 1986-88 the Royals had the highest payroll in the majors…and this is nearly 10 years after the advent of free agency. The Royals were loaded and a great team…so much has changed in 20-25 years. I think it’s time for the little guy to take some power back. On any given year a small market team with a ton of talent should be able to approach the upper third of payrolls without completely destroying their business model and their future.

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By: leadoff http://www.piratesprospects.com/2013/04/first-pitch-the-downside-of-the-new-cba-starting-to-appear-for-the-pirates.html#comment-26229 Wed, 10 Apr 2013 15:15:50 +0000 http://www.piratesprospects.com/?p=49904#comment-26229 The system is not designed for small market teams to win in MLB, but it is designed for them to succeed. It is designed for teams to succeed and win in hockey and the NFL.
Lets define winning?
The real victory in pro sports to franchises is how they do financially.
The Pirates had a far better record than the Boston Red Sox, guess who made more money? The Rays got in the playoffs, guess who made more money between the Rays and Sox?
The NFL owners are in charge of their product, the players are in charge of the product in MLB. The union wants the big money spent on FA players, not the draft, if the union wanted big money spent on the draft this system would never have happened.
The owners can vote on anything they want, it still has to be approved by the union.

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By: wkkortas http://www.piratesprospects.com/2013/04/first-pitch-the-downside-of-the-new-cba-starting-to-appear-for-the-pirates.html#comment-26228 Wed, 10 Apr 2013 15:13:25 +0000 http://www.piratesprospects.com/?p=49904#comment-26228 Interesting point; I remember years ago, and this was at a time where the local TV revenues weren’t as skewed as they are at the moment, Bill James was writing that small-market teams have power, they were just reluctant to use it. His reasoning was, in effect, that people weren’t paying to watch the Dodgers have an intra-squad scrimmage or an exhibition against Albuquerque–they were watching them play the Pirates and Padres, and that the Bucs and Pads should take the position “Look, we don’t get more of that TV money, screw it–we’re just not coming.” Now that’s a radical position, and not one that rich owners are likely to take, but it’s pretty much the threat that teams like the Bucs will have to use to get some fiscal equity.

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By: Fred Langford http://www.piratesprospects.com/2013/04/first-pitch-the-downside-of-the-new-cba-starting-to-appear-for-the-pirates.html#comment-26226 Wed, 10 Apr 2013 14:58:39 +0000 http://www.piratesprospects.com/?p=49904#comment-26226 A good facility gives you a good place to develop players. Money talks when it comes to top prospects. Latin agents are just as greedy as american ones…if not more.

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By: Fred Langford http://www.piratesprospects.com/2013/04/first-pitch-the-downside-of-the-new-cba-starting-to-appear-for-the-pirates.html#comment-26225 Wed, 10 Apr 2013 14:57:17 +0000 http://www.piratesprospects.com/?p=49904#comment-26225 It always amazes me with Selig being a former owner of a smaller revenue team that he became a giant schill for the rich owners once he became commissioner. What I dont understand is why the small market teams dont revolt and stand up to the mlbs rich teams, whose goal seems to eventually have 8 teams in the league. Do the poorer teams’ owners not have a say? This almost seems like when the players say “We have a bad CBA.” Well, you morons ratified it.

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