INDIANAPOLIS — All eyes are on him, but Drew Hutchison has not had an auspicious beginning to his career with the Pirates organization.

Hutchison was the lone piece to come over from the Blue Jays in the much ballyhooed trade that shipped out Pirates starting pitcher Francisco Liriano, and prospects Reese McGuire and Harold Ramirez.

And when you’re the lone piece of one side of the trade, much less a multi-player trade, it’s easy to figure out whose shoulders the success of the deal rest on. So, yeah, no pressure.

Hutchison has made 73 career major league starts, all with the Blue Jays since 2012. But he had never been traded and getting acclimated to a new organization may have played a part in his performance during his first start with Triple-A Indianapolis last week at Columbus. The outing wasn’t awful, but not great either.He gave up a two-run home run in the first inning against Columbus and had control issues in the fifth inning.

“I’m sure even with his experience there was a little bit of anxiety in that start,” Indianapolis manager Dean Treanor said, noting many players can put pressure on themselves when traded. “I think they do it all the time and not trying to speak for [Hutchison] — but yeah, especially with the three players and one is Francisco Liriano. But then they throw in two prospects and then it’s like, ‘Woah.’ I’m sure there was a little bit of that going into his first start with everybody wanting to see how he did.”

As soon as the notion, or more specifically, just the word “anxiety” was brought up to Hutchison when discussing his first start, he quickly interjected.

“No I don’t think that had anything to do with the performance,” Hutchison said. “I think I was just a little off. It’s been a different week from anything I’ve experienced. But I wouldn’t say it was anxiety or anything like that — just trying to get here, get to know everyone and get started here.”

Hutchison’s second start, against Toledo on Monday, began well with four shutout innings. But then the fifth inning rolled around and Hutchison allowed five runs before getting pulled. But a different issue arose in this start: he had a callus break open on his throwing thumb at the beginning of the fifth inning. That hindered his grip, which in turn, led to command issues.

But two less than spectacular outings — both with extenuating circumstances — isn’t likely going to sway how Pirates management view Hutchison. He’s a player the organization has been trying to acquire for several years, Pirates general manager Neal Huntington said to a group of reporters, including Alan Saunders of Pirates Prospects.

“Like the other pitchers we’ve had success with, he has quality pitches, whether it’s the fastball or the ability to keep the fastball out of the center of the plate,” Huntington said. “There’s velocity. This is not a feel-to-pitch right-hander. This is a guy we’ve seen up to 95 in the past. He can spin a breaking ball. He can throw a changeup to both sides, right and left. He can throw it behind in the count.”

All it took was one start for Treanor to have confidence in the way Hutchison pitches, watching him use both sides of the plate. His breaking ball was good, while his changeup was solid. Hutchison also impressed by being able to bounce back from command issues to pitch a pair of scoreless inning afterwards in the start at Columbus.

“He has a tendency to elevate the ball,” Treanor said. “But he knows how to elevate the ball and when to elevate the ball, so I think that’s the biggest thing.”

Hutchison made 19 starts with Triple-A Buffalo this season, compiling a 3.39 ERA in 109 innings. He struck out 115 and walked just 39. But he was stuck in Triple-A because the Blue Jays have remained consistent with a starting rotation of R.A. Dickey, Marco Estrada, J.A. Happ, Aaron Sanchez, and Marcus Stroman.

“Our indicators show that our surface results are what we would expect them to be,” Huntington said. “We feel that changing leagues … right now he’s stuck behind a pretty good rotation. We’d take all five of those starters and put them into our rotation without thinking twice about it. That’s why he’s in Triple-A. Like the other pitchers we’ve had some success with, the indicators are there, the scouts like the pitcher, and we feel like there are some things we can do to help him.”

Hutchison said he hasn’t had any extended conversations about changes to pitching style or otherwise, noting he’s working on getting acclimated to his new teammates and organization.

Treanor said there’s one main attribute Hutchison needs to show in the near future: consistency.

“It’s obvious he’s going to go there at some point, whether it’s before September or September,” Treanor said. “I just think he needs to get consistent with his stuff and kind of get a feel for the organization and what our pitching philosophy is. I think it was a solid first outing but I’m sure he wasn’t happy with it.”

Hutchison had a 5.57 ERA and 4.21 xFIP in 28 starts with the Blue Jays last season; while he had a 4.48 ERA and 3.82 xFIP in 32 starts in 2014. Those results, mixed in with the potential they see in Hutchison, made him one of the organization’s next reclamation projects with hopes of the success they found with Liriano, A.J. Burnett, and Edinson Volquez.

“Subjectively, our guys like the pitcher, they like the athlete, the intelligence, they like the feel to pitch, the awareness, the swing recognition,” Huntington said. “Objectively, there are some things there that indicate there are better results on the horizon. As we broke down some things with his mechanics and his pitch sequencing and his pitch selection and uses, we thought there were some things we can help him with moving forward. It doesn’t always work, as we have some evidence here in the recent past, but there are the opportunities that we believe we need to take to roll this thing forward.”

The success of the trade will take quite some time to properly evaluate. And just two starts is too soon to pass complete judgment on Hutchison. A first start with a new organization is never going to be easy, but Hutchison recovered fairly well in that one. And Hutchison had thrown four shutout innings before a broken callus derailed his command in his second outing on Monday. But it appears as long as he shows some level of consistency with Indianapolis, Hutchison will get a chance to pitch with the Pirates this season and that will be the next small step in evaluating the benefit of the trade.

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105 COMMENTS

  1. In two starts since the trade deadline, Matt Moore has garnered a 58 and a 60 game score (while pitching to a 5.19 xFIP).

    Vogey has a 70 and 67. 9th best pitcher in MLB in August. 3.03 xFIP.

    Sure, it’s SSS, but early returns suggest the folks who wanted to target Smyly, assuming he’d be cheaper, have results on their side.

    But none of that addresses the real issues.

    IMO, heat should be off Searage but should drop on Jeff Branson and Hurdle like a 2-ton weight. Worst offense in the NL in August (-0.2 fWAR, 28 runs) and in 2nd half (0.0 WAR, 76 runs, .221 BA, .298 OBP). That’s 3.45 runs per game.

  2. Like the F/O said, I’d as well be happy with something along the success of the following in this organization: Burnett, Happ, Liriano and Burnett, along with Harrahan, Grilli, Gonzalez and Melancon. I’ll trust this history over the histrionics of the nay-sayers, said the sooth-sayer.

    Plus. let’s see what the $18,000,000 brings.

  3. I really, really, hope lots of people enjoy eating crow after Hutchison turns out to be the next Burnett, Liriano, Volquez, Happ, etc…

  4. All one has to know about the 2016 Bucco saga and its planning is NH’s quote (and dig at Cole?): We’d take all five of those starters and put them into our rotation without thinking twice about it.

  5. NMR, where art thou?

    Huntington should run for political office… I love his “we just had to
    have Hutchison spin” to the Liriano salary dump. If they love
    Hutchison as much as they claim they do, they are on an island with that feeling. Hutch is a below average AAA pitcher, what an fn joke that trade was. I think Brault, Kingham, Kuhl and even Frank Duncan are more talented.

    Every major league team has multiple contracts way worse than Liriano. One
    more year of Liriano @ $13m is nothing compared to other team’s bad
    contracts. Right now, factoring in arbitration raises, the Pirates
    payroll is about $80m next year. Can’t wait to see what they do with
    their “financial flexibility.” Better craft beer selection at the Foggy
    Goggle?

  6. Enough with the pitching prospects.

    This organization has a dearth of (potential) power bats with nothing on the horizon.
    We need a thumper, which regardless of all the negatives that Alvarez brought in his suitcase, he was always a threat to hit one out.

    We haven’t been able to replace his power, which I believe is a much overlooked and under covered reason for this team’s offensive struggles.

    • The Pirates have better power numbers this year (.146 ISO vs .136 last year, 36.6 AB/HR vs 40.2 last year) without Alvarez and Walker.

      They also have prospects who can hit for power in Josh Bell and Austin Meadows.

      • Tim if you had a crystal ball is there any shot in hell we see Bell before September first besides a Jaso injury?

              • I was half kidding. But only half. I hear he’s on track to pitch soon but there’s a good chance he’s not cracking the rotation again this year and then service time conversations start up along with whether or not his change up/control get him to the next level. It’s scary but it’s a probably a conversation next Spring.

                • If we come out of spring training next season with Bell and Glasnow at Indy until the Super 2 deadline I am going to lose my mind.

                • Isn’t Glasnow accumulating ML service time right now since he’s on the Major League disabled list? If that’s correct you gotta think they’re not gonna worry about Super 2 with him next year because by this point it’d be pushed back well into July.

                  • Actually, if you send him down when he’s scheduled to come back from the DL, and keep him down, Super 2 eligibility would likely expire in early July 2017.

                    I don’t want to see Glasgow up until he gets himself figured out enough to walk less than 4 batters per 9. If that takes till mid-2018 I don’t care. He is a huge lottery ticket, not a sure thing at all IMO. Best to handle that shaky confidence with kid gloves.

      • Thanks, Tim.
        If you choose to proffer Bell and Meadows as power hitters then you are falling into the same trap as management in not pursuing any.
        Potential, yes. Displayed, I don’t see it.
        Your power numbers vs 2015 fail to address a middle of the lineup threat which is sorely lacking, which effects the hitters around them as well as opposing managerial decisions. They have more home runs off the bench than in the cleanup/#5 spot.
        I ask you; who is our cleanup threat and who in the minors is ready to fill that void within the next year?
        I say we need to pay up and get one.

      • NL average ISO is up from .144 last year to .158 this year. NL HR/AB was 36.3 in 2015 and 31.3 in 2016. Pirates have not lost any ground with the loss of Alvarez and Walker, and that’s saying something.

        (context)

      • I couldn’t figure out how the hell that was possible and then I realized Freese, Rodriguez and Joyce probably have about 35 between them. NH screwed up the 2016 rotation but he certainly nailed the bench. I think that’s going to flip flop next year as I don’t expect any of those three to resign in 2017.

    • I’m not a fan of the WAR stat because I don’t really understand it, but use this info as you will:

      According to baseball reference:

      Pedro: .6 WAR
      Walker: 1.6 WAR

      Jaso: 0 WAR
      J Hay: .6 WAR
      Freese: 1.6 WAR
      S Rod: .9 WAR
      Frazier: .6 WAR

      Obviously not a perfect comparison, but it would appear that the Pirates would have been better with Walker, but not necessarily Pedro.

      • The problem with Pedro was never really his bat it was his glove. If the NL had a DH Pedro would probably still be a Pirate with a multi year deal. He just didn’t have that value in the NL.
        Walker on the other hand I will be paying attention to see if the back problems he had this year that landed him on the DL become a repeat issue.

        • It’s a shame. I was a big Pedro fan. I don’t even think his positioning was that bad and he was able to make some decent picks at first. But he would literally just miss balls thrown at his glove. I don’t think I’ve ever seen anything like it. Catching yips almost. I think if he could catch a ball at first they would’ve tendered him and he would’ve been the bridge to Bell.

          • Like Morton & Locke, Pedro was almost always emotionally weak. Time to move on from all of those guys.

          • I still see the Cardinals refusing to pitch to him in the playoffs and during key series.
            Balance that with we take him out of the lineup for the wildcard game.
            He got the throwing yips at third where his hands were fine, then catching yips at first.
            At the time of his draft there were, as usual, pundits who said he was wrong for the Pirates.
            The power was there when the confidence was there. It is a damn shame it did not work out.

          • And to top it off, he had multiple throws actually go *through* his glove. I’ve never even seen that before and it happened to him twice! It would have been comical if it wasn’t so painful.

      • There is another component that is missing – salary. Walker and Pedro would have cost us about $20 million. The list above is less than $16 million.

        The better evaluation would be Walker (1.6) to J Hay, Freese, and S Rod (3.1)

  7. We can all question the moves and the results will speak for themselves but the Pirates are trying to address the toughest thing….acquiring controllable starting pitching. Since the FA price tags are ridiculous they are trying a prospect price tag to see if they have something

    Again time will tell. If indeed this reclamation project works as well as Liriano or volquez or Burnett (all starters that didn’t figure in their teams plans) then this will be a very good move as Hutch won’t be a one and done. If not then it will be a bad move.

    Seeing Pomeranz and hill yield big prospects and pitchers like hellickson and Santana and odorizzi stay with their teams because of the asking price it is clear that an outside the box strategy is needed.

    • I agree with your general assessment about the difficulties to acquire young controllable pitching but if your going to pay the price in prospects instead of dollars, why target a guy in AAA that you need to keep in AAA to manipulate an extra year of service time?

    • “Seeing Pomeranz and hill yield big prospects and pitchers like hellickson and Santana and odorizzi stay with their teams because of the asking price it is clear that an outside the box strategy is needed.”

      Talk about missing the forest through the trees!

      The Padres acquired Pomeranz at the huge cost of busted former prospect Yonder Alonso, Hill was signed for just $6m, and Hellickson required uber-prospect Sam McWilliams. Those are the “ridiculous” costs of good pitching?

      There are absolutely still good value deals out there, Huntington simply missed them this year.

  8. I hate to burst everyone’s bubble, but the likelihood of Hutchison ever becoming more than bullpen arm and maybe a backend rotation guy are slim. His stuff is not overwhelming and he doesn’t have an overly impressive track record in AAA so far.

    • Now that my bubble is burst maybe we can get a box of magic dust and sprinkle it on him. NH is disingenuous and now offensive that he says this guy is a world beater. Sounds like Lambo and Snider .

  9. By July 1 next year, Glasnow will be the #1, followed by Cole and Taillon. The remaining two slots will be occupied by some combination of Brault, Hutchison, Kingham, and Kuhl. Unless of course, NH decides to go get a couple more veteran reclamation projects and block some of these kids for another year….

    • You realistically have 8 options on paper for next year. You have Cole and Taillon like you said. Then most likely the next 3 spots (depending on injury) would go to Hutchinson, Kuhl and Brault. That leaves you Glasnow to force his way into the rotation because if he’s pitching like he can he won’t be blocked. Then you have Williams as the 7th guy and maybe Kingham come June or July after building up some innings.
      I’m leaving out Holmes and Duncan and I’m not expecting miracles if they resign Sadler and Cumpton.
      If they sign a guy it should be someone who is a cheaper reclamation project who can slide to the long man role if the younger guys prove to be better rotation options. In other words I would prefer one Vogelsong type signing period. You have to let Kuhl and Brault show what they have in the majors to see if they can stick. At least in my opinion. And at that point your starting rotation is extraordinarily cap friendly and once again…………you have financial flexibility.

  10. Still don’t like the value at all. But I’m willing to give Drew til next June to see if he can place himself in the middle of the rotation. If he cements himself behind Cole and Taillon then great -this wasn’t just a salary dump. But if he’s fighting it out with Brault, Williams and Vogelsong 2.0 for the 5th spot next year I’ll be pissed.

    • He came from the Blue Jays, all five starters are mentioned right above that. Stroman and Dickey aren’t doing great, but they have both had success in the past and it is a tough division. The other three are all putting up strong numbers this season. Hutchison was their #6 starter

          • Yea but doesn’t being under valued mean that you shouldn’t have to give up a lot of value to acquire the asset? Giving away a lot of value in the form of prospects to acquire a guy who is not being valued makes no sense. The value in this trade is plain and simple, the value of shedding 17 million in salary and that, to the Pirates at least, is worth two of your top 10 prospects. This coming from a GM who wont trade talented prospects to acquire an immediate impact player with ACTUAL value. We know where this teams priorities lie that’s for sure.

            • Exactly! I am a big NH fan but I have no idea what he was doing on this one other than getting rid of salary and taking a flyer on a guy that might be a back end starter….really hate this trade.

              • I also have a lot of respect for NH. That’s why this is a head-scratcher, which means Nutting had to be behind this type of move.

            • The only guy they traded who has actual value to the Pirates was McGuire. Liriano was below replacement level this year. Clearly they thought he was on downslope. Ramirez is looking more like a DH, or maybe even a AAAA type player, every step he gets closer to the big leagues. With Pirates OF depth, he was very expendable.

              Hey, but if it makes you feel better keep bitching about another man’s money. It is America’s newest pastime after all.

          • Wow, Ramirez was the 12th rated prospect, not the 10th. That makes all the difference. All this after the fact downgrading of the potential of McGuire and Ramirez is embarrassing. McGuire is a 21 year old first round pick catcher spending the entire season at AA. He has excellent defensive skills and is holding his own offensively. The kind of prospect that any team would love to have in its system, and certainly more valuable than Hutchison. Ramirez is also 21 years old and 4th in batting average in the AA Eastern League. But all of a sudden now that he’s been traded he’s Jose Tabata Jr.

            • Harold Ramirez: Singles hitters who do nothing else hold little value in the modern game. A player like him has to do other things well to add value, like stealing bases, taking BB’s, taking HB’s, having a great arm, playing great defense, etc…

              Last season Ramirez hit 337/399/458/857 in 300ish AB’s. He stole 22 bases at a 60% success rate. He covered a lot of ground in the outfield, and made enough great catches to overcome his mediocre arm. He had a great season, and his prospect value went up. This was coming off a couple years where he had been benched for attitude issues, and was held back in extended spring training when he should have been playing full season ball because he came in significantly out of shape. Unfortunately the guy has a bad body that puts on weight easily, he’s 5’10” 220lbs these days. But things were looking up last year, and he does have that sweet swing.

              This season he fell off to 306/356/399/755, almost a 100 point drop. His speed visibly declined. He’s not getting to balls he did last season in the OF, and he only stole 7 bases at a terrible 41% rate in 80 more AB’s. His developing power scouts were dreaming on has fallen off. He doesn’t walk much, or take a lot of HB’s like Marte does to get his OBP up to add value.

              The guy is simply turning into Jose Tabata right before our eyes, but at a younger age. Almost very prospect rating service that actually sends scouts to games downgraded him his summer, most to a 4th outfielder type. He hits a lot of singles, but he can’t run, doesn’t get on base at a high rate, doesn’t hit for power, and has an average-at-best arm.

              • I didn’t say that Ramirez was better than Hutchison, I said that McGuire was. I notice that you only addressed Ramirez in your latest tirade. If the trade had only included Ramirez, I wouldn’t have been unhappy. But even then I think that it is way too premature to dismiss Ramirez as Jose Tabata Jr.

            • I would bet that all this outrage would have been muted some if Ramirez was the only prospect heading north because of our OF depth. As we saw as recently as this season, catching depth is fleeting.

              • Honestly – I was pretty pissed off when I first heard McGuire was part of the deal. Been hoping for 2 years now that bat would come along and we would have an excellent player on our hands.

                Then I read a bunch of national mid-summer reports downgrading him once again, and I chilled out a bit.

                • When Elias Diaz was 21, he had an OPS of 550 at lower A West Virginia. Will Craig, this year’s first round draft pick, is older than McGuire and he is in short season A. I can’t think of anything more absurd than coming to any conclusion about whether a 21 year old is going to have success hitting in the majors.

                  • Well there are a ton of guys around the country making a living doing exactly that Koloacat. Kinda thought the rest of your post was going somewhere until that. At least there is a point of fact to it.

                  • But you have already determined he will have a better career than Hutchison. Clearly the Pirates brass disagrees. No disrespect, but they may have s better chance of being right than you.

                    • The Pirates brass are all knowing, blah, blah, blah, everything they say is true, blah, blah, blah. When NH says absurd things, like it wasn’t a salary dump and Hutchison was worth McGuire and Ramirez, I wonder to myself why do they bother, who would believe this garbage? And then I see posts like yours, and I realize that there really are people like you that believe everything they say.

            • We didn’t downgrade anyone after the fact, our mid-season update was well before the trading deadline, and in fact, we moved McGuire up. Tenth or 12th doesn’t make a difference as far as the trade, we have written about that numerous times that we didn’t like the trade, everything is searchable on this site to see that fact. If he’s going to quote a placement of a prospect on our site though, I’m going to make sure it’s correct. We did not have Ramirez top ten before the deal, so therefore, I do not agree they traded away two top 10 prospects. That was the simple point I was making.

              • I understand that this site did not adjust it’s rankings after the fact, my comment was directed to a number of other comments I have seen since the Liriano trade that try and downplay the quality of McGuire and Ramirez as prospects in order to justify the trade. I will say that the difference between 10th and 12th rated prospect is de minimus, after all they were both tier 3 players in the mid season rankings, and the article said there really weren’t significant differences between 9 and 11, or 11 and 15. Ramirez was ranked around #6 at the beginning of the season and Adam Frazier was ranked in the upper 20’s as I recall. Which says two things. First, the rankings can change quickly based on actual performance, and second, any player in that top 30 is a potential major leaguer.

          • JD and Tim….It really doesn’t matter whether they were 10th, 12th or whatever, we gave them up for a 6th starter who has been horrible in the majors so far.

            THAT is the bottom line.

            • Horrible in the majors so far? 3.85/FIP and 3.82/xFIP with 8.97/KP in 184.2 IP for 2.3 fWAR in 2014 is pretty damn good. Entering last season, he was almost universally regarded as a breakout candidate.

              THAT is the factual line.

              • That was two years ago. What has he done since? I will tell you?
                5.57/4.42 in 2015
                4.97/6.53 (SSS to be sure) in 2016
                career – 4.92/4.23

                What does it tell you that they wanted Frankie over this bum? If they wanted to do that 6 man rotation, why didn’t they just bring him up?

                At best, Hutchison will be a RH Jeff Locke.

                It was a salary dump, pure and simple.

                They saw NH desperate to unload some cash and took advantage of him.

                And, as always, I hope I am dead wrong about Drew. But at first blush, this trade stinks.

                • You said he’s been horrible in the majors and that simply isn’t the case. Hell, even a 4.21 xFIP last year wasn’t bad. And as Tim said, which you keep ignoring, he was only a 6th starter this year because of better options.

                  Many of the qualities Hutchison possesses are the same NH and Co. saw in Burnett, Happ, Liriano, Volquez, etc. They may be types of different pitchers, but the Pirates obviously see something in him and I’ll defer to that judgment.

                  You can bash the trade all you want, but I’ll wait until we see Hutchison pitch next year after a full offseason with Uncle Ray. I’m also of the belief that dumping Liriano was a GOOD thing. He was the worst starter in baseball, and it truly looked and felt like the NL had figured him out after 3 years. I wish him nothing but success in the AL.

                  • Okay…scratch the “horrible” word.

                    Howabout NOT GOOD? 🙂

                    You said:
                    And as Tim said, which you keep ignoring (actually I’m not…see below), he was only a 6th starter this year because of better options.

                    And you keep ignoring what I said:
                    What does it tell you that they wanted Frankie over this bum? If they wanted to do that 6 man rotation, why didn’t they just bring him up?

                    That tells me that he WASN”T the 6th option.

                    The nice thing about being a fan, is that you can both bash and laud trades. I have always been a NH supporter but this trade has all the earmarks of being a stinkeroo.

                    I assume you DON’T think it is a stinkeroo. 🙂

                    I guess we’ll have to agree to disagree.

                    Standard Disclaimer
                    As always, when I denigrate a player or trade, I hope I am wrong. 🙂

                    • You know Lee I personally haven’t really formed an opinion of the trade, not enough info yet. Other than our past huge successes with pitchers like Hutchinson, and the rapidly declining value of the prospects sent over for him.

                      Oh and I was and am all for getting rid of Liriano, even if it took a prospect like Ramirez to do it.

                    • Once again, opinion stated as fact. Maybe if they make you this angry, you should consider not putting your time into being a fan.

                      I used to be so so angry at the Org because they were incompetent, and wouldn’t play Moneyball. The day they drafted Moskos high in the 1st, I dropped them like a hot match. Didn’t even watch an inning on TV till 2012, when I discovered they hard started playing Moneyball, and well, years before.

                      Maybe it’s time for a break. Something to consider.

                    • The only break I need is from people who will defend spending an asset like McGuire to dump salary.

                    • Would it make you feel better if I said they traded McGuire for Hutchison, and traded Liriano and Ramirez for player(s) to be determined later with the salary flexibility gained?

                    • Not really, because trading McGuire for Hutchison is an awful trade too. Either the Pirates made this trade as a salary dump or they don’t know what they are doing. I prefer the former explanation.

                    • You and others keep harping on McGuire – it is getting REALLY OLD – time to move on…
                      He has at least two more years in the minors barring Blue Jay injuries and will be Martins backup IF he makes it to the majors

                      Get over it!

                    • They didn’t want just Frankie, they wanted him, plus “tabata” plus Reese. Now that they have him and are paying him they are surely going to pitch him.

                      And it wasn’t a salary dump, it was a Liriano dump, and the salary went along for the ride. If Liriano wasn’t pitching abysmally they never would have traded him.

            • You act like both of us didn’t write about not liking the deal. Sorry you don’t like Hutchison, but he’s here now, so we will talk about him, especially the first chance we get to talk to him.

      • Thanks John, I was hoping he wasn’t referring to our rotation. He can spin this however he wants and call it purely a baseball trade, but Hutchison will not define this trade. What will define this trade is Reese McGuire and what they do with the money they shed from Frankies contract.

        • Hutchison is THE major component of this trade for Pirates! His performance will most certainly define this trade.

            • They’re in the Blue Jays system. I said for the Pirates. Meaning his acquisition is more important than what is done w payroll flexibility of money saved.

          • What do you think his potential is? Even if he becomes a 3 or 4, that was still an overpay for what we gave them. I don’t disagree that he’s the component of the trade. I just think what they do with the Liriano money is just as important.

            • Clearly Pirates brass see something in him not evident in his stats. They do have a solid track record in evaluating SP’s. Not perfect, but solid. They must think he can be better than a #3/4.

    • NH was referring to Toronto’s rotation. He stated that each of Toronto’s starting five would start in Pgh if they were here

  11. There should really be no pressure on Hutchison since everyone is aware that he is just the facade covering a trade to shed salary. There are few that are truly expecting Hutchinson to succeed most are just hoping with little confidence. If he does succeed, then thats fantastic for both the fans and the front office who can hide behind his success.

    • Honestly, I read these comments for some entertainment and an occasional nugget that a reader has originated that is original and makes me think, The level of discourse since the Hutchinson trade has become tired. You are all boring the hell out of me. What do you want at tis point? Huntington’s or maybe Tim’s head on a pike? Move on – we’ll all be able to evaluate the net affects of this trade in 16 months. Until then it’s speculation. Please move on to another topic.

      • Ken, please let us know what you would like us to talk about. Then we will proceed, if that pleases you, sir.

      • Gotta say man I can’t see how this is particular comment is beating the dead horse. I get it, pirate fans can be a bit…thorough in their whippings of the FO, but this is a very valid point. Most of us really don’t put an excessive amount of pressure on Hutchinson to succeed because even the most optimistic fans know he is at best a lottery ticket. I get annoyed by the endless rabble-rabble as much as anyone but rj isnt really doing that here imo

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